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15 Feb 2014, 09:02

Posts: 9
Where is it? This games progression system is a clone of COD. I'm sick of this casual BS. Why can't another company make a game like Halo? I want an addicting formula, and something to works towards. You shouldn't simply earn "your level" from playing the game. You should earn your level from practice, strategy, and team work.

This game is fun, but without some type of incentive to win and get that sense of satisfaction it will be dead to me in a few months.

I understand this is the beta, but if this is an indication of the progression system in the final build, I'm concerned.


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15 Feb 2014, 09:17

Posts: 1446
I think its odd that you critique the competitive viability through the progression system. When i think of games like dota2, lol, and sc2, which have some of the most successful competitive scenes, i don't think of awesome progression systems.


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15 Feb 2014, 09:35

Posts: 178
Cod 2 had a good competitve scene and it had absolutely zero progression system.

Progress was shooting the guy before he shot you. Repeat.


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15 Feb 2014, 09:59

Posts: 330
I can't see how progression is bound to competitive play?
Progression is a way of forcing you to learn everything step by step and is supposed to motivation as well as a method to not overwhelm player with complexity from the start.




15 Feb 2014, 10:05

Posts: 1085
Progression is how games are meant to run, in one way or another. Think about it, every single game you play is progression, it's gamer psychology.

Without going into it to much, almost all games can be broken down to;
Short Term Rewards
Medium Term Rewards
Long Term Rewards

In this instance (and I'm very simply summarising here) short term is levelling up and killing grunts, medium term rewards are getting Titans, and long term rewards are levelling up and getting new weapons etc.

There are more examples to this system obviously, but in short... I don't think progression will be going away from games any time soon.

However, most real reward competitions are ALWAYS played under LAN conditions, which would be apart from the public playlists




15 Feb 2014, 10:19

Posts: 3
It's talk like this that make me miss the Quake 3 and Unreal Tournament days. It was just you, your gun, and unadulterated skill. I don't play competitive shooters to progress or level up, I've got a full time job, and I don't have time for any of that noise. I play to kick ass and chew bubble gum. But that's just me.




15 Feb 2014, 10:26

Posts: 9
I agree. I love the game though, but I play games to be competitive, to play in tournaments and leagues, and to compete with people of similar skill. I don't want to earn challenges that level me up 5 levels in one match. I, and MANY others, want to level just as it was in Halo 3.

You earn your ranking through winning. The grind and competitive nature of getting a 50 in MLG in H3 was what made that game absolutely amazing competitively. I've played with several level 14's, who you should assume would be good, that go like 2-15 in a game. People can literally just jump in a game, shove their hands into their ass, and get free levels .. it's a little sad.




15 Feb 2014, 10:27

Posts: 6
If the game is fun you play it. If it isn't you don't. You need a carrot on a stick to keep playing? YOu are doing something wrong.

In fact, games would be better off with everything unlocked from the start.




15 Feb 2014, 10:28

Posts: 9
evilmuska wrote:
It's talk like this that make me miss the Quake 3 and Unreal Tournament days. It was just you, your gun, and unadulterated skill. I don't play competitive shooters to progress or level up, I've got a full time job, and I don't have time for any of that noise. I play to kick ass and chew bubble gum. But that's just me.


Exactly.

Let me clarify. I don't care if the progression system stays. Just be sure to implement a second system based solely off player skill. Halo 3 achieved this. There was a visible level 1-50. There was also a visible xp military rank. In this scenario, both parties win.

At the moment this beta is entirely too easy. I'm wrecking everyone I face. It's boring.

Which brings me to my next point - Halo matched you with players of similar skill. The games were balanced, and believe it or not, FUN!

My matches in Titanfall thus far have been lopsided. When I run with a party it's been a massacre. This could easily be fixed if Respawn were to only match us against other parties rather than randoms. And players of similar skill. But that would be asking too much, it's not like Halo 2 achieved this in 2005.


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15 Feb 2014, 10:32

Posts: 6
TaintBlast wrote:
I agree. I love the game though, but I play games to be competitive, to play in tournaments and leagues, and to compete with people of similar skill. I don't want to earn challenges that level me up 5 levels in one match. I, and MANY others, want to level just as it was in Halo 3.

You earn your ranking through winning. The grind and competitive nature of getting a 50 in MLG in H3 was what made that game absolutely amazing competitively. I've played with several level 14's, who you should assume would be good, that go like 2-15 in a game. People can literally just jump in a game, shove their hands into their ass, and get free levels .. it's a little sad.


You mistake progression (unlocking stuff) with ranks. You should complain there's no ranked system. Not yet anyway.




15 Feb 2014, 10:33

Posts: 9
TarPalantir wrote:
TaintBlast wrote:
I agree. I love the game though, but I play games to be competitive, to play in tournaments and leagues, and to compete with people of similar skill. I don't want to earn challenges that level me up 5 levels in one match. I, and MANY others, want to level just as it was in Halo 3.

You earn your ranking through winning. The grind and competitive nature of getting a 50 in MLG in H3 was what made that game absolutely amazing competitively. I've played with several level 14's, who you should assume would be good, that go like 2-15 in a game. People can literally just jump in a game, shove their hands into their ass, and get free levels .. it's a little sad.


You mistake progression (unlocking stuff) with ranks. You should complain there's no ranked system. Not yet anyway.


Well all I have to say is that they better implement a ranked ladder or a sort of "League Play" that Black OPS 2 included.

A competitive playlist for players that are actually good at the game so it creates a competitive atmosphere. Almost everything is unlocked and people make loadouts based on what they have and they go in and play against other players that want the competitive nature of the game.

I'm already tired of playing against casual players and going like 40-1 (combined) every game.




15 Feb 2014, 10:37

Posts: 1085
Please, teach me how to be so godly /sarcasm

It's a beta, there are multiple modes missing, as are multiple titans, weapons, attachments etc.

It is not representative of the final product




15 Feb 2014, 10:39

Posts: 309
love how you base the competitive scene off a closed beta..




15 Feb 2014, 10:44

Posts: 9
htownballa wrote:
love how you base the competitive scene off a closed beta..


I clearly acknowledged in my OP that it was the beta build.

That being said, please provide me a source of where they hint at hitting the competitive community. Don't forget these are the developers of COD. Even Halo 4 lost ranks in favor of the COD crowd. That worked out well...


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21 Mar 2014, 09:00

Posts: 9
Well, like many other competitive gamers predicted, the game is too easy. I held off on posting this until I at least reached a "Gen2" and had 1000+ kills against players (not bots).

This game is boring, as predicted it has no matchmaking formula for true skill. Matches are lopsided and I never go negative. My KD is a 3.1 vs players. Either I need to be pro, or matchmaking needs to be fixed so I can actually enjoy a challenge.

It's funny that Halo 2 has more depth than this. In a way I'm happy, Halo still remains the console fps king. No other game can touch how competitive and intense multiplayer used to be in Halo. It's too bad gamers have grown so sensitive and lazy. Even Halo 4 adapted to the simple everybody is a winner formula.


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21 Mar 2014, 09:24

Posts: 965
I cant sympathize with these elitist "competitive" players. Why do they feel they should be catered to?


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21 Mar 2014, 09:37

Posts: 70
TeaTime wrote:
I cant sympathize with these elitist "competitive" players. Why do they feel they should be catered to?


Well, they're obviously better people than we are.

After all, they've spent more time developing their ability to react to flickering lights by twitching in a particular direction.




21 Mar 2014, 11:00

Posts: 377
Plays a game made by OG CoD devs - is surprised that there are similarities to CoD *golf clap* ;)




21 Mar 2014, 11:56

Posts: 4
There shouldn't be leveling at all. TF2 didn't have it and I played well over 1k hours...




21 Mar 2014, 14:18

Posts: 37
Balancing can be built on the competitive play. Where things should be, how powerful things should be are shown at their full potential in competitive play.

yes halo 3 did have the best ranking system. One would work themselves up the ladder. They also had a non-ranked arena where most people would play.

It felt good to have a high rank and seeing someone with a higher rank was something you'd aspire to be. also to be feared.

it kept games close and prevented players from leaving because of the penalty of a auto lose and lopsided games always have the loosing team quitting out.

People don't like ending up in lopsided games.


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21 Mar 2014, 14:37

Posts: 353
Go to BF then if you want a bunch of "different" copy paste guns just for the sake of progressing. If the game is fun, how is that not enough to keep people playing.


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21 Mar 2014, 15:02

Posts: 106
Team Fortress 2 doesn't have any progression system and they have a huge competitive base. Including ESEA-Support, which leads to cash prizes.




21 Mar 2014, 15:33

Posts: 355
Halo's ranking system was great. I think this is something that Respawn could have done a spin of... Even with the regeneration system I suppose a ranked playlist could still accomplish this?




21 Mar 2014, 16:02

Posts: 412
Progression in the manner that CoD et all provide is an illusion. It's a lure. It's the dangling carrot, tempting players to keep playing.

Nothing wrong with that, per se but the OP has a point that the reward is too easily achieved for 95% of the content that anyone not OCD is really bothered about.

Take the AI in Titanfall. It serves zero purpose other than to give players wind up time to Titans and for XP to level. We can all agree that they offer no resistance. Their inclusion as anything other than fluff for the worse players to level on is laughable. This AI, considering what we've been led to believe about teh power of teh Azure Cloud is the worst I think I've ever seen in an FPS. Half Life 1 had better AI than Titanfall.

When progression in a game is seen as a given, not something that you earn through effort and having to increase your skill then it's ultimately pointless. If all it takes is time played then, at best it's a hollow victory all too soon forgotten.




21 Mar 2014, 18:02

Posts: 349
GeorgeRoper wrote:
Progression in the manner that CoD et all provide is an illusion. It's a lure. It's the dangling carrot, tempting players to keep playing.

Nothing wrong with that, per se but the OP has a point that the reward is too easily achieved for 95% of the content that anyone not OCD is really bothered about.

Take the AI in Titanfall. It serves zero purpose other than to give players wind up time to Titans and for XP to level. We can all agree that they offer no resistance. Their inclusion as anything other than fluff for the worse players to level on is laughable. This AI, considering what we've been led to believe about teh power of teh Azure Cloud is the worst I think I've ever seen in an FPS. Half Life 1 had better AI than Titanfall.

When progression in a game is seen as a given, not something that you earn through effort and having to increase your skill then it's ultimately pointless. If all it takes is time played then, at best it's a hollow victory all too soon forgotten.


Ok about the AI, its not that they couldn't make better AI they are by design meant to be easy so they can properly serve their purpose on the battle field. Witch they do well.

And for the Azure servers they do exactly as it was advertized in this game, run the AI. Witch there is a lot of in a match.

As for for the whole competitive thing, as i understood it this game was advertized as a casual game. In one of the interviews they said that they wanted to make a fun game first then they would focus on the competitive community if it was demanded, witch clearly it is. So relax, respawn is thinking about you and will most likely get the game to support your playstlyes in time friend.


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